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The current time is: 12/16/2017 2:20:47 AM
 General Military History    
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anemone
DONCASTER S. YORKS, UK
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 6103
http:// 82.44.47.99
Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/20/2017 2:02:08 PM
A masterpiece of aerodynamic engineering, the Spitfire was among the finest fighter aircraft of the Second World War.

For information only
[Read More]

Regards

Jim
---------------
Pro Patria Saepe Pro Rege Semper

jahenders
Colorado Springs, CO, USA
top 50
E-4 Specialist
Posts: 74

Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/20/2017 3:10:05 PM
Would definitely agree that it's among the best. Always hard (if not impossible) to say that one is THE best because it's always a question of the role being considered and the environment it's in. It's made even more complicated by the fact that there are MANY of different versions of most of these planes and they can vary widely.

Among the best of WWII (that were produced in numbers and extensively used), I'd list (in no specific order):
- Spitfire
- P-51 Mustang
- ME 109
- P-38 Lightning
- P-47 Thunderbolt
- FW 190
- F-4U Corsair

Others to consider:
- ME 262
- Yak-3
- Hawker Hurricane
- A6M Zero
- F6 Hellcat

brian grafton
Victoria, BC, Canada
top 10
E-9 Sergeant Major
Moderator


Posts: 1460

Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/20/2017 7:51:31 PM
Agree. In my weekly pub luncheon crowd, I have one buddy (now nearly 86) who flew piggy-back in a dual P-51 and fell in love, while another buddy (aged 51) who claims if he wins the lottery his first purchase will be a Spitfire. He's a water-bomber pilot, so he doesn't need the Spit to fulfill a flight-challenge gap in his life.

Personally, I've always had a soft spot for the Fw-190 in all its iterations. I may be wrong, but it seems to me to be the most field-adaptable a/c of the war. The Luftwaffe seemed to be able to hook anything onto the -190, under just about any conditions.

I'm surprised how fully my response to Jim's comments are based on childhood gut reactions. I think as a kid (and we're talking Korean War time here), I thought the three most beautiful a/c in the world were the Spitfire, the Airacobra ( Bell P-39) and the Lightning (Locheed P-38). I still feel that the P-38 and P-39 were amongst the most misused and ill-treated of a/c too complex for their time. At least, that's what my inner child tells me to write!

Cheers
Brian G

---------------
"We have met the enemy, and he is us." Walt Kelly.

"The Best Things in Life Aren't Things" Bumper sticker.

Michigan Dave
Muskegon, Michigan, MI, USA
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 2964

Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/20/2017 8:48:33 PM
[Read More]

Those are 5 pretty decent fighters!?
MD

More WWII Fighter Planes pics;

[Read More]

I think that WWII Fighters are the coolest planes of all time!

[Read More]
---------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."

anemone
DONCASTER S. YORKS, UK
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 6103
http:// 82.44.47.99
Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/21/2017 3:36:06 AM
The Mark V Spitfires were powered by the Merlin 45 and 46 engines, producing 1470hp at 16,000ft.

These new, more powerful Spitfires were the Air Ministry’s response to the introduction of the Messerschmitt Me 109 F and the Focke-Wulf FW 190 in the spring of 1941, both of which clearly outclassed the Spitfire Mark II.The Mark V could at least equate with these formidable Germans

The Mark VAs could reach a speed of 376mph at 19,500ft, at which height the Mark VB’s speed was 369mph, whilst the Mark VCs reached 374mph at 13,000ft.

The climb performance of the Mark Vs was improved, being able to reach 10,000ft in 3 minutes 6 seconds, and 30,000ft in 12 minutes 12 seconds. The Spitfire’s ceiling was also raised by some 2,000ft.

The Mark IX was the daddy-taking over from the Mk V as the most commonly manufactured plane of the later series, with some 5,500 produced, of which more than 1,000 went to Russia. Increasing numbers of Spitfires were also being sent to the Middle Eastern and Far Eastern theatres.

Climb and level speed performance has been measured on Spitfire F. Mk. IX B.F.274 both with and without a 30 gallon external jettisonable tank fitted. The climb performance at combat rating and position error have also been measured without the tank fitted. The engine was fitted with a 0.477:1 reduction gear and a Rotol R3/4F5/3 metal propeller.

Climb at normal rating:
Maximum rate of climb in M.S. supercharger 3200 ft.min at 13,500 ft.
Maximum rate of climb in F.S. supercharger 2540 ft/min. at 25,900 ft.

Service ceiling (100 ft/min) 42,100 ft.
Time to 10,000 ft. 3.1 mins.
Time to 20,000 ft. 6.5 mins.
Time to 30,000 ft. 10.7 mins
Time to 40,000 ft. 20.2 mins

Climb at Combat rating:
Maximum rate of climb in M.S. supercharger 3860 ft.min at 12,600 ft.
Maximum rate of climb in F.S. supercharger 3020 ft/min. at 25,200 ft.

Service ceiling (100 ft/min) 43,400 ft.
Time to 10,000 ft. 2.7 mins
Time to 20,000 ft. 5.6 mins.
Time to 30,000 ft. 9.2 mins
Time to 40,000 ft. 16.6 mins

Level Speeds.
Maximum true air speed in M.S. supercharger 380 1/2 m.p.h. at 15,400 ft.
Maximum true air speed in F.S. supercharger 403 m.p.h. at 27,400 ft.


Regards

Jim
---------------
Pro Patria Saepe Pro Rege Semper

jahenders
Colorado Springs, CO, USA
top 50
E-4 Specialist
Posts: 74

Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/21/2017 3:45:02 PM
I would definitely agree that the P-38 is the most beautiful plane of WWII and it was sometimes misused. Pilots had a hard time getting used to the dual, counter-rotating props and crashed atr an elevated rate as they were getting trained. The Army also didn't pursue some great upgrades that they could have because the National Advisory Committee for Aeronautics (NACA) study on it was long delayed (like 1+ years) for some reason. Since the study (and hence the upgrades) were delayed, the Army focused more on the P-51. Had the P-38 received some of these upgrades, or received them earlier, we might have seen heavier/later use of P-38s and more of them relative to P-51s (and P-47s).

brian grafton
Victoria, BC, Canada
top 10
E-9 Sergeant Major
Moderator


Posts: 1460

Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/21/2017 9:49:36 PM
Jahenders, good comment.

I assume you know that part of the bad rep the P-38 received arose because the Brits ordered some p-38s very early in the contract, but without both the turbocharging and the counter rotation. Oddly, , the a/c did not offer performance up to specificatons!

Cheers
Brian G
---------------
"We have met the enemy, and he is us." Walt Kelly.

"The Best Things in Life Aren't Things" Bumper sticker.

anemone
DONCASTER S. YORKS, UK
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 6103
http:// 82.44.47.99
Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/22/2017 3:40:24 AM
After evaluation tests at Farnborough, the P-38 was kept in fighting service in Europe for a while longer. Although many failings were remedied with the introduction of the P-38J, by September 1944, all but one of the Lightning groups in the Eighth Air Force had converted to the P-51 Mustang-a serious contender for best fighter aircraft in WW2

Regards

Jim
---------------
Pro Patria Saepe Pro Rege Semper

George
Centre Hastings, ON, Canada
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major
Posts: 5729

Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/22/2017 6:26:48 AM
I don't know whether the Hawker Typhoon and Hawker Tempest fit into this category but I always admired the power of these two planes. The Tempest was an effective interceptor both against the FW190 and the flying bombs.

Tempest



anemone
DONCASTER S. YORKS, UK
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 6103
http:// 82.44.47.99
Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/25/2017 11:37:28 AM
Hawker Tempest-a truly majestic aircraft

"Reaching Newchurch airfield at 480 mph I held "RB" down to 20 ft from the runway and then pulled her up to a 60 ° climb holding it as the speed dropped slowly off and the altimeter needle spun round the dial as if it were mad. At 7000 ft the speed was dropping below 180 mph and I rolled the Tempest lazily inverted, then allowed the nose to drop until the horizon, at first above my head, disappeared below (or rather above) the now inverted nose, the fields and woods steadied into the centre of the windscreen and then whirled around as I put the stick hard over and rolled around the vertical dive. Steadying again I pulled out over the tree tops at 500 mph, throttled back and pulled hard over towards the airfield in an over-the-vertical climbing turn, lowering the wheels and flaps in a roll as the speed dropped. What a magnificent aeroplane! They could have all their Spitfires and Mustangs!"
("My part of the sky", Roland Beamont)

"The Messerschmitt Me 262's most dangerous opponent was the British Hawker Tempest - extremely fast at low altitudes, highly-manoeuvrable and heavily-armed."
(Hubert Lange, Me262 pilot)

Regards

Jim
---------------
Pro Patria Saepe Pro Rege Semper

jahenders
Colorado Springs, CO, USA
top 50
E-4 Specialist
Posts: 74

Re: Supernarine Spitfire-A History
Posted on: 9/25/2017 3:21:58 PM
I had forgotten that. Thanks for mentioning that.

What makes that even more ironic is that when the USAAF first got the P-51 Mustang, they were NOT impressed and only ordered a handful. The RAF was more interested and bought more, using them primarily for recon and ground attack. It had good performance at low altitude and good range so it was the first single-seat fighter to escort bombers to Germany (October 22, 1942) and they were RAF bombers (not US).

Only after the P-51 switched to the Merlin was it taken seriously as a fighter/interceptor and did the USAAF start buying them in quantity.

Michigan Dave
Muskegon, Michigan, MI, USA
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 2964

Supermarine Spitfire A History!
Posted on: 9/26/2017 9:38:22 AM
Hi Guys,

Here is an exceptional documentary on the history of the Super Marine Spitfire,

check it out & comment.

[Read More]

cheers,

MD

Also my favorite scenes from the recent movie Dunkirk, involve the Spitfire!

[Read More]

Is there anything more exciting than a life and death dogfight??

[Read More]

Ya gotta love the Spitfire, just ask Kai, he flew in one!?
---------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."

anemone
DONCASTER S. YORKS, UK
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 6103
http:// 82.44.47.99
Re: Supermarine Spitfire A History!
Posted on: 9/26/2017 10:01:57 AM
Many thanks Dave for the very fine footage depicting the History of the Spitfire-it really "belongs" in this thread.Do keep up the good work that you do.


Best Regards

Jim
---------------
Pro Patria Saepe Pro Rege Semper

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