MHO Home   Forum Home   Help   Register   Login
 
 
Welcome to MilitaryHistoryOnline.com.
You are not signed in.
The current time is: 10/19/2017 2:24:16 PM
 Ordnance    
AuthorMessage
George
Centre Hastings, ON, Canada
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major
Posts: 5297

Avro Arrow prototype found in Lake Ontario
Posted on: 9/8/2017 6:45:50 AM
Other than Canadians, few will remember that in the post WW2 era, Canada was actually working at the forefront of the aerospace industry.

The centre piece development of that work was and advanced fighter jet called the Avro Canada CF105 Arrow.



Claims were made that there was really nothing comparable in the '50's to this jet including the Iroquois engine produced at Orenda Aircraft in Malton, Ont.

It's a long sad story but Canadians were justifiably proud of this accomplishment. Workers in Toronto would go out on their front lawns to cheer as the plane broke the sound barrier on test flights over their homes in Downsview, north of Toronto.

The US and the British did not place orders and the Canadian government decided to scrap this project and did so overnight.

On Feb. 20, 1959, the Arrow project was stopped, putting several thousand people out of work.

The 5 (or was it 6) test planes were ordered to be cut up and destroyed as were the plans for the plane and the engine.

Nothing was to be left but memories.

Avro, which had many other projects including a flying saucer in its R and D section, was effectively out of business.

Many Canadian engineers and plant workers were scooped up by the aerospace industry in the US. My uncle was one of them.

Except that during the early phase of production, scale models of the Arrow were developed and in test flights were sent out over Lake Ontario. These scale models were launched by rocket I believe and were designed to test wind drag among other things.

There were 9 of them. I believe that 3 of them were launched in Virginia.

Anyway, it appears that someone has discovered one of the test prototypes somewhere in Lake Ontario.

As there is nothing left of the Arrow other than rumours that one completely functioning full sized plane was spirited away and missed the welding torch that tore the others apart, the discovery of the scale model would be an important addition to the Canadian Aviation and Aerospace Museum in Ottawa.

It is nearly 60 years ago now that the Arrow programme was scuppered. Still lamented as the reason that a burgeoning industry in Canada died.

[Read More]


Michigan Dave
Muskegon, Michigan, MI, USA
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major


Posts: 2760

Re: Avro Arrow prototype found in Lake Ontario
Posted on: 9/8/2017 2:30:58 PM
George,

That,s so cool, where in Lake Ontario did they find it? Sad about it effecting your economy.

Cheers,
MD
---------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."

George
Centre Hastings, ON, Canada
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major
Posts: 5297

Re: Avro Arrow prototype found in Lake Ontario
Posted on: 9/8/2017 8:57:05 PM

Quote:
George,

That,s so cool, where in Lake Ontario did they find it? Sad about it effecting your economy.

Cheers,
MD
--Michigan Dave


It affected the national psyche I think. We were all so proud of the Arrow and it was a fabulous aircraft. From what we have been told, there was nothing like it being designed so quite a feat of engineering.

When the programme was scrapped, 30,000 people were out of work. Most were phoned on Sunday and told not to come in on Monday.

My father-in-law was one of them. He was a machinist but intensely proud of "his" Arrow.

There was a suburb in Downsview, a part of Toronto, that was built to house the work force for the Arrow programme.

Most of the men in that suburb were Avro or Orenda aircraft employees.

My father-in-law said that when the word got out that the Arrow was dead, the men went to the beer store and bought a few two-fours and got royally drunk on the front lawns. The next day, it was time to look for work.

The devices that they are looking for and the one that they have found were pre-flight prototypes. They were launched by rocket and were much smaller than the actual plane.

They were test devices.

All of the actual planes that were later produced were destroyed and cut up for scrap.

Anyway, the pre-flight prototype was found off Point Petre on Lake Erie. That is where most of the models were launched.

Point Petre is near Point Pelee National Park and not too far from Windsor and Detroit. The launch point was about an hour out of Windsor.

This is an old video of the first flight of the Arrow in 1958. It was produced by the Avro Aircraft Company.

[Read More]

If you listen carefully you may detect an accent in the voice of the test pilot. There were several test pilots but one of them was Janusz (Jan) Zurakowski. "Zura" was a decorated Polish fighter pilot who had flown for Poland and for Great Britain during WW2. He emigrated to Canada after the war and was a very successful test pilot for A.V. Roe

And this is a documentary about the Arrow and controversies that surround the cancellation.

[Read More]

Cheers,

George


richto90
Bremerton, WA, USA
top 25
E-6 Staff Sergeant
Posts: 396

Re: Avro Arrow prototype found in Lake Ontario
Posted on: 9/11/2017 4:42:36 PM

Quote:
If you listen carefully you may detect an accent in the voice of the test pilot. There were several test pilots but one of them was Janusz (Jan) Zurakowski. "Zura" was a decorated Polish fighter pilot who had flown for Poland and for Great Britain during WW2. He emigrated to Canada after the war and was a very successful test pilot for A.V. Roe


I may have mentioned before, but another of the test pilots was Jolly's stepfather, Peter Cope. A remarkable man...spent his passage to the U.S. for pilot training with playing poker, cleaning out the other pilot candidates and officers on board. Got his wings in Texas from the U.S. Army Air Corps and proud of it. Flew Spitfires and then Mustangs in low-level photo-reconnaissance "dicing" missions and ended the war as CO of a PR Squadron, then was selected for the first class of the postwar Empire Test Pilot School. However, he got tired of postwar Britain's rationing and when AVRO Canada reached out looking for test pilots he emigrated. Flew the both AVRO fighter development programs - the CF-100 and the CF-105, along with most other AVRO aircraft...and the flying saucer.

When the Arrow program was cancelled Peter took a job with Boeing in Seattle...his last stint was with the 747.

Cheers!

George
Centre Hastings, ON, Canada
top 5
E-9 Cmd Sgt Major
Posts: 5297

Re: Avro Arrow prototype found in Lake Ontario
Posted on: 9/12/2017 9:21:16 AM
Thanks for the information on Cope, Rich. As I recall, only 5 men ever flew the Arrow and the two with the greatest number of hours on the plane were Polish pilots.

There was a story that a 6th pilot was actually taxiing in the Arrow for his first flight and was called back as the word came down that the project was dead.

I did want to mention that AVRO was not a one project company.

It had men working on all sorts of projects including North America's first jet transport aircraft, the C-102 Jetliner.

Delays to the development of the Arrow also impacted on this project, so the C-102 was actually beaten out by the De Havilland jetliner as the first in the world.




AVRO had a top secret project called the AVRO Car which was supposed to be a short take-off and landing aircraft.

It looked more like a flying saucer. The USAF was heavily involved in the funding.

A little promotional video made by AVRO in its heyday.

[Read More]

[Read More]


It all died when PM John Diefenbaker scrapped the Arrow and our best and brightest made a beeline to the US and GB to work on their projects.

It was a political and economic move that killed an industry.

Cheers,

George


 Ordnance    
 Forum Ads from Google