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vpatrick
MA MA USA
Posts: 2522
Joined: 2020
This day in World History! Continued
5/13/2023 5:35:29 PM
Quote:
Quote:
BTW up late last night watching the Stanley Cup playoffs, Leafs lost to Florida 3-2 in OT! Im Pulling for Canadian based teams without my wings in it!? Also Edmonton Lost to the knights, I must be bad luck?? Any comments on the NHL games??


No comments fit to be be posted on this family forum.
Cheers,

George


George,

My Bruins had the best regular season in the history of the NHL only to be defeated in the first round of the playoffs by these upstart Panthers after being up 3-1. Alot of us around here try to compare this to other Boston sports team disasters, like the 07 Patriots who had the perfect season and to be defeated in the super bowl or the 86 red Sox, But this one is much worse because the Bruins had three tries to defeat the Panthers not just one game as Patriots had in 07, and to finally be defeated at home! I blame the coach he should have been resting his players and not give a crap about the regular season record the Bruins looked tired during the series and nobody cares about the regular season when its over they care about the cup! So I feel your pain, but I have to give it to the Panthers they play hard and I think they may get the cup.

Whats weird around here nobody even wants to talk about this loss its to painful, folks complained about the 86 Red Sox for decades.



vpatrick
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nuts
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/13/2023 7:33:56 PM
Moved to new page for further discussions!??

1943 on May 13th, 250,00O German & Italian troops surrender! What were the major factors in the win?? .Comments anyone?? As the Allies win in N. Africa!

Just a few events from.the BBC site for 5-14, comments welcome? Anyone??

1796 British Doctor Edward Jenner develops a vaccination to combat smallpox using believe this!? Puss from Cowpox !gross you say??

1948 British mandate for Palestine! The state of Israel is proclaimed by the Jews! What say you on the British helping create Isreal?? Anyone??

1955 the Soviets & Eastern Europe create the Warsaw Pact! Does it exist at all today?? Was it really a alliance forced by the Soviets? Does it effect the Russian invasion of the Ukraine at all?? What say you? Anyone??

Any other new history? Anyone??
MD

BTW up late last night watching the Stanley Cup playoffs, Leafs lost to Florida 3-2 in OT! Im Pulling for Canadian based teams without my wings in it!? Also Edmonton Lost to the knights, I must be bad luck?? Any more comments on the NHL games?
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"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
vpatrick
MA MA USA
Posts: 2522
Joined: 2020
This day in World History! Continued
5/13/2023 7:52:46 PM
Quote:


BTW up late last night watching the Stanley Cup playoffs, Leafs lost to Florida 3-2 in OT! Im Pulling for Canadian based teams without my wings in it!? Also Edmonton Lost to the knights, I must be bad luck?? Any comments on the NHL games??



you brought it up Dave you cant expect folks not to comment on it and then ask it to be moved to another thread
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nuts
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/13/2023 7:54:08 PM
Right on!!!!!!
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"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/14/2023 8:29:01 AM
George,

In reference to your post on the UK & the creation of Isreal. Reposted below:

Why is it that the US feels such a need to fully support Isreal? It certainly has lead to the US being disliked by many other countries in the middleast!?

Anyone?
MD

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"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/14/2023 8:31:09 AM
Referring to this post:

Quote:
Quote:
1948 British mandate for Palestine! The state of Israel is proclaimed by the Jews! What say you on the British helping create Isreal?? Anyone??


At the end of WW1 the British forces had defeated the remains of the Ottoman Empire in Palestine. We know that the international community had interests in that part of the world but Britain had secured Arab support when it promised that a Palestinian Arab state would be created once the Ottoman Empire was defeated. Britain had made promises that it was unable to keep.

It was the League of Nations that granted a mandate to Britain to administer to the territories of Palestine and TransJordan in the '20's. Mandates were created to provide a peaceful transition to independence and while a territory found its footing, a more stable nation would provide administrative services. Britain exercised its mandate for several decades.

It has been a while since I studied the British Balfour Report of 1917 but if memory serves Balfour declared that it was British policy that a home for the Jews would be found in Palestine but a Palestinian territory must be created at the same time. I think that that was the meat of it.

Britain had tried to regulate the immigration of Jews to the Palestinian Territory but after the horrors of WWII, some British politicians felt that it was morally reprehensible to prevent the world's remaining Jews from emigrating to Palestine if they wished. Even during the war, Britain regulated immigration of European Jews to Israel, not wishing to upset the Arab people by adding Jewish immigrants at a faster rate.

By the end of the war, Britain was under pressure from the US to support Zionism. Britain was opposed to the creation of a Zionist state without Arab approval, and Britain and President Truman were at odds. In 1946 Truman wanted Britain to allow 100,000 Jewish immigrants into Palestine, immediately. Britain balked as it was negotiating with the Arabs in the territory and other Arab nations to assure that both sides were happy.

The US and Britain would be at odds as to how to resolve the Palestinian issue.

Note that British soldiers were dying in Palestine at the hands of Jewish groups that demanded recognition of a Jewish state. The British considered these groups to be terrorists as they engaged in bombings and assassinations. The British launched military operations against them in 1946. The bombing continued.

In 1947, Britain asked the UN to step in to resolve the issues regarding the partition of Palestine. And in 1947 the UN surprisingly voted for partition. Britain was hopeful that it could withdraw but still had to maintain troops there to keep the peace. Britain allowed some autonomy in the Jewish areas and the Arab areas and was happy to withdraw some troops. But Britain had to intervene when trouble arose.

A good deal of what Britain proposed in its mandate was not accepted by the US and some other UN members. Britain still had interests in the area and that included Egypt and TransJordan. Britain had good reason to make promises to these countries as well.

It was Britain that delayed its recognition of the state of Israel until 1949. This upset the US and Truman who was anxious to see its allies approve of this new state of which the US approved. Of course, Arab states had immediately attacked the new Israel in 1948 because they did not approve of the deal.

Of note, it would not be long until the Suez Canal crisis began and the US did not support France and Britain when they sent troops to Egypt to regain control of the canal that they owned.

So yes, Britain finally approved of the existence of the State of Israel but was not happy with the deal that had been brokered. In 1937 Britain had proposed a partition plan that would create three zones, Israel, and Arab state and the City of Jerusalem which would be declared an international city. The 1947 UN plan also called for a Jewish and an Arab state but as mentioned, the Arabs rejected it as they saw the UN deal as heavily favoured toward Israel. I don't believe that the UN plan addressed the issue of Jerusalem which is a holy city to a number of faiths.

I would not say that the UK created Israel. Britain had a great deal of experience in the area but its proposals which would hopefully appease both the Jews and the Arabs were not accepted. Britain's influence on world affairs was waning.

I wish that I was better educated on this subject so that I could determine whether the British plans would have kept us out of the mess that we are in now with respect to Israel and the Palestinian Arabs. Perhaps someone with greater knowledge will weigh in.

Cheers,

George





Anyone else want to weigh in???
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"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
scoucer
Berlin  Germany
Posts: 3270
Joined: 2010
This day in World History! Continued
5/14/2023 9:21:57 AM
Quote:
Spring and summer are quite busy as I fill the orders my wife's "honey-do" list. I hid the shovels and rakes but she found them.
Cheers,George


I remember those. Somehow, it metamorphoses into a "Papa, can you ? -list"

I used to joke about the kids visiting "Mama, the fridge, the washing machine and Papa´s wallet." In that order.

Trevor
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`Hey don´t the wars come easy and don´t the peace come hard`- Buffy Sainte-Marie Some swim with the stream. Some swim against the stream. Me - I´m stuck somewhere in the woods and can´t even find the stupid stream.
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/14/2023 10:52:29 AM
Quote:
On this day in 1972, Alabama governor George C Wallace was victim of an assassination attempt while running as a Democratic presidential candidate. The attack took place in Laurel, Maryland, and Governor Wallace was left paralyzed from the waist down.

I remember George Wallace; he was a bogeyman of the decade beginning in the early 1960s. He was, IMHO, an opportunist, willing to argue values which would aid his continued political career. Does that make him a populist rather than a segregationist? Tell that to the black people of Alabama who lived under his governorship from 1962,

By 1968, Wallace ran as the presidential candidate for the American Independence Party. I believe he gained 13% of the vote, which is an indication of the tumult of the US in the late 1960s. His VP running mate was one Curtis LeMay. I believe he took five southern states. If that wasn’t scary in the US world of government by majority, I don’t know what is.

I’m not supportive of assassination in any way. I was pleased to see Governor Wallace survive the attempt, and I’m happy to see he continued to be active in politics almost the the day he died.

Nonetheless, for at least some furriners like me George Wallace was a frightening and hindward-looking candidate to be seeking main-stream support for a presidential bid.

I simply remember.

Cheers
Brian G



Thanks Brian,

What say Ya'll about George Wallace? Where & why did he get all of his support??

Anyone??
MD
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"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/14/2023 2:27:29 PM
Quote:
George,

In reference to your post on the UK & the creation of Isreal. Reposted below:

Why is it that the US feels such a need to fully support Isreal? It certainly has lead to the US being disliked by many other countries in the middleast!?

Anyone?
MD




People always point to the pro-Israel lobby groups in the US to explain US foreign policy in the Middle East, including the support of Israel. There is some truth to that but it is a facile argument. The US is a powerful nation and I think that its strategies in all parts of the world in which it has an interest are carefully crafted based on US needs, what is good for the US. That is how all nations should craft foreign policy and so the US must have other reasons to support Israel.

It would be nice to think that the nations that support Israel do so out of altruistic motives, to make amends for the slaughter that took place in WWII. But if doing the right thing was always the motivation, then the US and its allies would be intervening in a place like Sudan.

Right now it seems that Israel can do no wrong in the eyes of the US. The US defends Israeli imperialism including building settlements in Palestinian territory. Any attempts to block motions of censure in the UN are either vetoed or at best, the US will abstain. But it wasn't always like this.

During the Suez Crisis in 1956 the US demanded that France and the UK pull troops out of Egypt. The UK was told that the US would sell off British bonds to devalue them. That would have created an economic crisis that post war Britain could not afford. But what is sometimes forgotten is that Israeli troops were also part of that invasion of Egypt and Israel was the first of the three to leave. Now I do not know what the US said to Israel to force them to leave but they did.

So this is my take on it. The Cold War occupied a good deal of US concerns and containment of communism was important. The USSR was making inroads with some of the Arab nations and Israel which was a democracy that shared some of the values of the US could be a bulwark against the advance of communism in the Middle East.

And after the cold war ended? The US has never stopped in its attempts to influence the political affairs of countries in that part of the world. And that includes invasions, some of which were not justified as it turns out. It continues to support some pretty sketchy governments like that of Saudi Arabia because that country helps to maintain regional stability, notwithstanding Yemen of course.

So is it oil? The US needs middle east oil as do many other countries and so regional stability would ensure that OPEC oil continued to flow. But the US needs much less oil. It is now an exporter of oil and can import a lot of what it needs from Canada.

Does the US need Israel to ensure stability in the Middle East and to assure that Russia and China don't make further inroads in the Middle East? How can Israel help to stop the proliferation of nukes in the region especially in Iran? Israel is likely a nuclear power itself but I think that the US would prefer that no other countries in the region are so armed. Iran as a nuclear power could destabilize the region.

The US and most of us are concerned about terrorist attacks and the training of terrorists in the region. The Israeli intelligence service is excellent and provides information to the US on developments in the terrorism file.

So the US must need Israeli support but I am unable to explain why the support is unequivocal. Certainly the wishes of the US voter could influence that support and many do support Israel.

But recent polls indicate that many US voters are unhappy with the treatment of the Palestinians by Israel. Yes, Hamas launches rockets from Gaza even as Israel builds settlements in west bank territory that could have been part of a Palestinian state had a proper deal been brokered. The Abraham Accords have only sowed discord as the Palestinians had no say in the development of the agreement. Some Americans recognize that error and wish to see Palestinian needs addressed. That could alter US foreign policy with respect to Israel though I could never see a day when the US would withdraw its military support from Israel.

Just my two cents.

George
DT509er
Santa Rosa CA USA
Posts: 1527
Joined: 2005
This day in World History! Continued
5/14/2023 4:29:27 PM
Quote:
So is it oil? The US needs middle east oil as do many other countries and so regional stability would ensure that OPEC oil continued to flow. But the US needs much less oil. It is now an exporter of oil and can import a lot of what it needs from Canada.

George


I disagree George, the US does not need mideast oil, rather, the US is quite capable of producing its own oil without ever having to touch our strategic reserve. Prior to the Chicom virus, "U.S. oil production hit an all-time high of just below 13 million barrels per day (BPD). As the pandemic unfolded, demand collapsed, and production followed. By May 2020, oil production had dropped by more than 3 million BPD to 9.7 million BPD."

With oil barrel prices spiking high, and the current US government administration committed to a suicide of green-energy policy at the expense of fossil fuels while transitioning to mideast oil supplies, US oil production and supplies dwindle away, and all at the expense of its citizens, including green energy supporters.

Dan
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"American parachutists-devils in baggy pants..." German officer, Italy 1944. “If your experiment needs statistics, you ought to have done a better experiment.” Lord Ernest Rutherford
Phil Andrade
London  UK
Posts: 6507
Joined: 2004
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 4:03:57 AM
Battle of New Market, Shenandoah, Virginia, 1864.

The adolescent cadets from the Virginia Military Institute are deployed in the attack against the yankees on the heights, and they shed their blood and lose their lives in this dramatic episode.

Every anniversary the names of the VMI cadets who were fatally hit in this action are read aloud, with the words “ Died on the Field of Honor” called out at every name.

Will this poignant commemoration still be tolerated, bearing in mind the culture wars that rent the Western World ?

Regards, Phil
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"Egad, sir, I do not know whether you will die on the gallows or of the pox!" "That will depend, my Lord, on whether I embrace your principles or your mistress." Earl of Sandwich and John Wilkes
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 6:59:09 AM
Guys,

Just a few events from.the BBC site for 5-14, a day late, & a dollar short! Comments welcome? Anyone?? I believe most, we haven't commented on yet?

1796 British Doctor Edward Jenner develops a vaccination to combat smallpox using believe this!? Puss from Cowpox !gross you say??

1948 British mandate for Palestine! The state of Israel is proclaimed by the Jews! What say you on the British helping create Isreal?? Anyone?? Thanks for the reply on this Brian!

1955 the Soviets & Eastern Europe create the Warsaw Pact! Does it exist at all today?? Was it really a alliance forced by the Soviets? Does it effect the Russian invasion of the Ukraine at all?? What say you? Anyone??

Any other new history? Anyone??
MD

Also as Phil points out, the Civil War Battle of New Market, fought by mere boys! There is a good movie on it as well, "Field of lost shoes" comments on the movie or the battle welcome? I believe you can watch it on YouTube for free? Can anyone post the website on it?

Can you imagine how desperate the Rebs had to be to fight these kids in battle? & how tough it would be to be a Union Soldier,, & sight in a young teenagers! Could you fire?? Comments?
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
morris crumley
Dunwoody GA USA
Posts: 3309
Joined: 2007
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 9:25:42 AM
As sad as the story of the battle of New Market, and the "field of lost shoes" is....The battle of Griswoldville is another sad example. It took place on 22 November, 1864.

As Sherman began his march to the sea, elements of O.O. Howards Army Of The Tennessee encountered three brigades of Georgia Militia at Griswoldville, an industrial town near Macon. The militia was being shifted from Macon to Augusta as that was thought to be Sherman`s objective.

Brigadier General Charles Walcutt ran into the militia and set up a defensive position with a clear killing field to his front, his flanks shielded by swamps and cavalry. A ravine cut across the center of the field. The Georgia Militia, commanded by General Pleasant Phillips, attacked Walcutt`s position of infantry, and artillery in three lines of battle and were cut to pieces by canister and small arms fire , and withdrew to the relative safety of the ravine. After they withdrew, Union troops found the mangled bodies of white haired old men laying dead next to boys as young as 10 or 12.

Even hardened veterans of the Union Army were sickened at the sad thought of who they had to fight.

Respects, Morris
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"You are a $70, red-wool, pure quill military genius, or the biggest damn fool in northern Mexico."
Phil Andrade
London  UK
Posts: 6507
Joined: 2004
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 10:23:26 AM
Quote:
As sad as the story of the battle of New Market, and the "field of lost shoes" is....The battle of Griswoldville is another sad example. It took place on 22 November, 1864.

As Sherman began his march to the sea, elements of O.O. Howards Army Of The Tennessee encountered three brigades of Georgia Militia at Griswoldville, an industrial town near Macon. The militia was being shifted from Macon to Augusta as that was thought to be Sherman`s objective.

Brigadier General Charles Walcutt ran into the militia and set up a defensive position with a clear killing field to his front, his flanks shielded by swamps and cavalry. A ravine cut across the center of the field. The Georgia Militia, commanded by General Pleasant Phillips, attacked Walcutt`s position of infantry, and artillery in three lines of battle and were cut to pieces by canister and small arms fire , and withdrew to the relative safety of the ravine. After they withdrew, Union troops found the mangled bodies of white haired old men laying dead next to boys as young as 10 or 12.

Even hardened veterans of the Union Army were sickened at the sad thought of who they had to fight.

Respects, Morris


Morris,

Does memory play tricks on me, or wasn't that episode the inspiration behind a Hollywood movie in the 1950s or 60s ? Maybe John Wayne starred in it. but what you've just related is strikingly similar to what I'm trying to recollect.

Regards, Phil
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"Egad, sir, I do not know whether you will die on the gallows or of the pox!" "That will depend, my Lord, on whether I embrace your principles or your mistress." Earl of Sandwich and John Wilkes
Phil Andrade
London  UK
Posts: 6507
Joined: 2004
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 10:42:26 AM
Quote:


Can you imagine how desperate the Rebs had to be to fight these kids in battle? & how tough it would be to be a Union Soldier,, & sight in a young teenagers! Could you fire?? Comments?


These kids being deployed notwithstanding, it was the yankees who really came unstuck in this fierce little battle.

Put in the cadets urged an officer.


They are only children, answered Breckinridge. Then he asked aloud : Will they stand ? Moments later , he gave the command Put the boys in , and may God forgive me for the order .

In the ensuing advance, 57 of the cadets were hit by enemy fire, 10 of them fatally. This was nearly one in four of those who went in.

As I said, though, it was the men in blue who took the real beating : while the confederates lost 43 killed and 474 wounded, the yankees lost 96 killed, 520 wounded and 225 missing.

Why the much higher proportion of fatal hits among the Union soldiers ? Their deployment exposed them to the deadlier fire. Nor did the 96 confirmed killed tell the whole story. Many of the missing were dead, too, it seems.

Fifteen days later, the Union army returned to the New Market battlefield and witnessed the ghastly debris.

In a slight hollow of the field, wrote an officer of the 34th Massachusetts, the bodies of our dead, thrown indiscriminately into a pile , and but partially covered in earth, presented a sickening sight. Feet, arms and heads were protruding at all points of this festering mass.

When the phrase " Field of Honor" is called out today, let's not forget that.

Regards, Phil




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"Egad, sir, I do not know whether you will die on the gallows or of the pox!" "That will depend, my Lord, on whether I embrace your principles or your mistress." Earl of Sandwich and John Wilkes
Lightning
Glasgow  UK
Posts: 1070
Joined: 2005
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 11:12:20 AM
Quote:


Brigadier General Charles Walcutt ran into the militia and set up a defensive position with a clear killing field to his front, his flanks shielded by swamps and cavalry. A ravine cut across the center of the field. The Georgia Militia, commanded by General Pleasant Phillips, attacked Walcutt`s position of infantry, and artillery in three lines of battle and were cut to pieces by canister and small arms fire , and withdrew to the relative safety of the ravine. After they withdrew, Union troops found the mangled bodies of white haired old men laying dead next to boys as young as 10 or 12.

Even hardened veterans of the Union Army were sickened at the sad thought of who they had to fight.



Morris,

I remember some years ago reading about this tragic engagement. I wonder if the revulsion felt by the Union troops was heightened by the fact they had mowed them down not knowing their relatively feeble composition of old men and young boys. As I recall, the militia didn't really get into proper eyesight of the entrenched Union infantry so they couldn't have known upon whom they were inflicting such carnage.

A true tragedy of the war.

Colin
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"There is no course open to us but to fight it out. Every position must be held to the last man: there must be no retirement. With our backs to the wall and believing in the justice of our cause, each one of us must fight to the end."
morris crumley
Dunwoody GA USA
Posts: 3309
Joined: 2007
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 11:29:12 AM
Phil, you are probably thinking of one of my favorite films, ( I have it on Blu-ray) "The Horse Soldiers." It is a fictional story of an actual Union brigade`s adventure behind Confederate lines in Mississippi during Grant`s Vickburg campaign known as " Greirson`s Raid." It does star John Wayne.

His brigade was tasked with destoying the rail and transport facility at Newton`s Station, then heading South all the way to Baton Rouge. You are thinking of the part of the movie that envolves the local militia and the boys of a nearby military academy who are called out to try and stop the raid, the story of which they based upon the battle of New Market.

The Commandant of the academy is an elderly Reverend, and there is a scene of a mother grabbing and pulling her son, not more than a 9 or ten-year old drummer boy, out of column and trying to drag him kicking and screaming back to home.

It is a bit of the Griswoldville story.

Respects, Morris
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"You are a $70, red-wool, pure quill military genius, or the biggest damn fool in northern Mexico."
morris crumley
Dunwoody GA USA
Posts: 3309
Joined: 2007
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 11:34:52 AM
Colin, I am pretty sure that Walcutt`s men had no real idea of the desperate composition of the militia`s roll, they were just trying to defend their position. It was after that the true horrors of the thing hit home to them.

Respects, Morris
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"You are a $70, red-wool, pure quill military genius, or the biggest damn fool in northern Mexico."
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 3:53:06 PM
Quote:
Quote:
So is it oil? The US needs middle east oil as do many other countries and so regional stability would ensure that OPEC oil continued to flow. But the US needs much less oil. It is now an exporter of oil and can import a lot of what it needs from Canada.

George


I disagree George, the US does not need mideast oil, rather, the US is quite capable of producing its own oil without ever having to touch our strategic reserve. Prior to the Chicom virus, "U.S. oil production hit an all-time high of just below 13 million barrels per day (BPD). As the pandemic unfolded, demand collapsed, and production followed. By May 2020, oil production had dropped by more than 3 million BPD to 9.7 million BPD."

With oil barrel prices spiking high, and the current US government administration committed to a suicide of green-energy policy at the expense of fossil fuels while transitioning to mideast oil supplies, US oil production and supplies dwindle away, and all at the expense of its citizens, including green energy supporters.

Dan



Hello Dan, if the data is accurate, the US may be a large producer of oil but it uses over 20 million barrels of crude per day. That is still higher than the peak production that you quoted in your post. Canada and Mexico provide more crude to US refineries than any other countries. Canada provides 4.7 million barrels per day to the US which is significantly more than any other country. Canada also provides refined oil products to the NE US through pipeline #5 to which Michigan is opposed.

So the question not whether the US needs to import because it does but why did the production of oil decline.

Bloomberg suggests that US government policy to promote green energy is a factor in discouraging production and that discourages investment.

But it also notes that US wells are becoming less productive and that the cost of oil services (not sure what that means) has increased making it more costly to get the crude out of the ground.

You mentioned the pandemic which led to decreased demand and many small oil extraction companies went out of business or just capped their wells. And many oil workers left the business to find work.

Biden has said that the industry is sitting on thousands of permits to drill federal lands that they aren't using. Industry representatives claim that the Biden's administration policies are hostile to the industry. Forbes reported that companies are stockpiling permits and using them at a slower pace due to a shortage of workers and fracking sand. (don't ask me )
Forbes also said that holding a permit is one thing but from the beginning of the use of the permit, years may pass before oil comes out of the ground.

It just seems like a complex issue to me. Meanwhile there is no shortage of oil in the US because of North American integration.

Cheers,

George
morris crumley
Dunwoody GA USA
Posts: 3309
Joined: 2007
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 5:33:04 PM
Without getting into politics George, oil companies may have permits to drill out the wazzu, but they want to drill where they feel the most productivity will be..not just where they have permits, and yes, permit in hand is still years before any oil actually gets produced.

Our Strategic Oil Reserve was intended for emergency usage of a short duration, or for strategic needs....not for use as a tool to lower prices because people are getting pissed at driving up the cost of oil through inflationary policy. That reserve is at it`s lowest point in 45 years.

Other Presidents have released oil from it for reasons such as pipeline stoppage, or hurricane interruption that put dangerous limitations on available supply...usually for not longer than a month or so. We have taken from it for well over a year now.

It is not a wise course of action. That`s all I`ll say.

Respects, Morris
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"You are a $70, red-wool, pure quill military genius, or the biggest damn fool in northern Mexico."
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 9:11:22 PM
Quote:
Without getting into politics George, oil companies may have permits to drill out the wazzu, but they want to drill where they feel the most productivity will be..not just where they have permits, and yes, permit in hand is still years before any oil actually gets produced.

Our Strategic Oil Reserve was intended for emergency usage of a short duration, or for strategic needs....not for use as a tool to lower prices because people are getting pissed at driving up the cost of oil through inflationary policy. That reserve is at it`s lowest point in 45 years.

Other Presidents have released oil from it for reasons such as pipeline stoppage, or hurricane interruption that put dangerous limitations on available supply...usually for not longer than a month or so. We have taken from it for well over a year now.

It is not a wise course of action. That`s all I`ll say.

Respects, Morris


Morris, there is another player in all of this and that's OPEC. The OPEC countries have been influencing oil prices forever it seems.

So when they decided to cut production way down the cost of a barrel of oil shot up and so did the price of petroleum products, gasoline. Was there another option to keeping gas prices down other than releasing product from the strategic oil reserves? I don't have an answer.

But I do remember the reaction in the US and here in Canada when the cost of gas sky rocketed. It is difficult for political administrations to ignore the unrest caused by high gas prices.

Cheers,

George

morris crumley
Dunwoody GA USA
Posts: 3309
Joined: 2007
This day in World History! Continued
5/15/2023 9:45:58 PM
George all I will say is that gas just down the street from my house was $2.26 a gallon on Jan. 20 2021...and we became concerned that it might climb to $7 or $8 as the year went by.

The invasion of Ukraine took place on February 24, 2022. Eleven months later, and during that time the prices had climbed and climbed.

It`s a simple fact.

Respectfully, Morris
----------------------------------
"You are a $70, red-wool, pure quill military genius, or the biggest damn fool in northern Mexico."
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/16/2023 7:23:03 AM
Topics, topics topics!!!??

Some events from.the BBC site for 5-14, comments welcome? Anyone?? I believe most, we haven't commented on yet? Any one??

1796 British Doctor Edward Jenner develops a vaccination to combat smallpox using believe this!? Puss from Cowpox !gross you say??

1948 British mandate for Palestine! The state of Israel is proclaimed by the Jews! What say you on the British helping create Isreal?? Anyone?? Thanks for the reply on this George!

1955 the Soviets & Eastern Europe create the Warsaw Pact! Does it exist at all today?? Was it really a alliance forced by the Soviets? Does it effect the Russian invasion of the Ukraine at all?? What say you? Anyone??


Checking 5-16 in history, here are some events? Comments, anyone?

1770 Marie Antoinette married King Louis XVI how did this become such a messy union for the common Frenchmen? Comments?

1801 William Seward who purchased Alaska was born, did he over step his bounds as Lincoln's Secretary! of State?
What say you?

1920 Joan of Arc is canonized by the Pope, why was she burned at the stake? She was after all a military commander who deserved better? Comments?

1943 the Warsaw Ghetto uprising is put down! You have to admire the courage of these condemned souls!?
Any good articles or websites on it?? Anyone?

Regards
MD

Also in 1975 the 1st women to climb Mt. Everest, A Japanese lady, why do so many make this attempt? Are they brave or crazy?? Many end fatal?? Comments anyone?

BTW Morris, & George, Do you guys use the website, "gas buddy"? It will tell you what stations have the cheapest gas in your area? Every penny counts! ☺
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
Phil Andrade
London  UK
Posts: 6507
Joined: 2004
This day in World History! Continued
5/16/2023 9:43:24 AM
1943 : The Dambusters !

Let’s talk more about the story of Israel .

US support is virtually axiomatic now, but - George has discussed this already- it’s a complex business.

Stalin advocated a national home for Jews at Yalta - or was it Potsdam ? - in 1945.

A generation after the Balfour Declaration.

Israeli kibbutz societies were communist inspired.

I suppose Arab states coalesced round soviet support and defined Cold War geo strategic developments in the Middle East.

Way out of my depth here !

Mustn’t forget Iran : not Arab, of course, but a massive influence.

Regards, Phil
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"Egad, sir, I do not know whether you will die on the gallows or of the pox!" "That will depend, my Lord, on whether I embrace your principles or your mistress." Earl of Sandwich and John Wilkes
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/16/2023 1:12:57 PM
Quote:
1801 William Seward who purchased Alaska was born, did he over step his bounds as Lincoln's Secretary! of State?
What say you?


It depends upon your frame of reference, I suppose. I can tell you that he was much despised in the Canadas both before the civil war and during.

But if I am being objective, I think that he proved to be a most effective politician and Sec. of State during the civil war. He continued to serve his country in President Johnson's administration and masterminded US foreign policy in that period. And in 1867 he swung that deal with the Russians that brought Alaska under US control.

He had served as the Gov. of New York and had been a senator for many years. He aspired to be the Republican Presidential candidate in 1860 but he was virulently anti-slavery and because he couldn't keep his mouth shut, everyone knew it. Abraham Lincoln was more circumspect on the matter and he was selected and won.

Seward was being consistent in his beliefs about slavery. Records show that Seward House in NY state was one of the stops on the Underground Railroad. The family hid runaway slaves in a room above a woodshed. Years later he would offer land to Harriet Tubman as a place for her to settle.

Quote:
“The Under­ground Railroad works wonderfully. Two passengers came here last night.”
. W.H. Seward

So Lincoln and Seward would seem like strange bedfellows as they were competitors. Seward wasn't one to be shy. He could offend but I would assess his behaviour during the civil war as business-like and statesmanlike. And he was a great supporter of his boss, Lincoln.

He was an Anglophobe and an annexationist. But during the civil war, he learned to tone down his rhetoric on that subject.

He was certainly angry that the Canadas and the British seemed to have had a tepid response to their own Neutrality Act. There was a good deal of talk of invading the Canadas partly as punishment for permitting Confederate operatives to work out of Montréal and Toronto. But Seward worked very well with Lord Monck who was the Governor General of British North America. Seward wasn't stupid and he realized that Monck was taking steps to ease tensions between the US and the Canadas and Britain.

Seward had initially been a proponent of invasion but when his boss Lincoln said that that was not part of the plan, Seward communicated effectively with Monck. Monck had set up special border patrols to catch Confederate raiders and had passed an Alien Act to prevent bad actors from staying in BNA. Monck also managed very well the Trent Affair which nearly brought Britain into the war. At this stage, Seward seemed to relish the thought that war with Britain was in the offing. Monck's conduct in the aftermath of the St. Alban's raid met with praise from Seward.

Seward eventually realized that the real purpose of Confederate raids planned and carried out from Canada was to bring the British into the war. If Britain had to respond to a US invasion of the Canadas, it would not have been able to stop that on land. But the mighty RN could have changed the calculus on the high seas as the Union blockade of southern ports would likely have been broken and a British blockade of northern ports enforced. The Confederates wanted Britain in the fight desperately.

Now if your frame of reference was one of a British North American, your view of William H. Seward was that he was a despicable character whose designs on BNA had been espoused loudly many times. Seward's belief in Manifest Destiny had many residents of BNA upset as he was quoted many times as saying that it was a given that BNA would join the US.

US newspapers were readily available in BNA and so Seward's firebrand comments were read by Canadians. In kind, many Canadian newspapers had little good to say about William Seward and during the war both Seward and the Union were portrayed as bullies trying to control southern states. It was an odd point of view as most Canadians were anti-slavery but they also felt that if the Union could beat the south into submission then it would probably try the same thing in BNA.

Seward and his agents worked very hard to annex British Columbia between 1865 and 1869. They tried to convince British politicians who wished to off load their colonial possessions that the British subjects in BC wanted to join the US. Canadian politicians had to send delegates to Britain to convince the Little Englanders that their perception of the situation in BC was incorrect.

He was supportive of a movement out of Pembina, North Dakota (then Minnesota) to build a rail line into the Red River settlement in what is now Manitoba. That would make the settlement dependent on a US rail line and encourage a north-south focus rather that to the east.

Even though 3 provinces of BNA had aligned in a Confederation in 1867, Seward felt that the parts of BNA that had not joined including BC and the massive Hudson Bay Co. holding called Rupert's Land were ripe for the picking.

Seward mused that if the US could acquire Alaska and Greenland then most of BNA would have been bookended by US territory and that the great middle would fall to the US willingly and happily. Not for Seward was the consideration that the people of BNA may have had a different view of how they wished to live.

One of our historians, Shelagh Grant of Trent University and a renowned expert on Arctic history said that Seward's dream of the acquisition of Greenland was not likely to come to fruition as the US was busy in southern reconstruction and had already acquired Alaska.

Grant also noted that despite being a wily politician, Seward had misread the mood of the people of BNA. While there were proponents of annexation in parts of BNA for the most part Canadians wanted no part of membership in the republic to the south which many observed was a violent country prone to fighting wars. They were shocked by the slaughter that took place during the civil war. Seward was oblivious to the anti-American sentiments prevalent in BNA at the end of the civil war.

So if I was an American I would probably begrudgingly express some admiration for Seward's dedication to his country. His management skills during the civil war were very good.

But I'm not an American of course and my view of the man is clouded by his zealous anglophobia and desire to acquire the land in which I live.

As for the acquisition of Alaska, the cession caused a great deal of concern in Canada and in Britain. For the British, it was a signal that the US had designs on the whole west coast. Seward spoke of the possibility of a land link between Alaska and Washington territory that would be effected by the annexation of British Columbia


For both Britain and Canada, the fact that the Alaskan panhandle could become part of the US meant that a good deal of the Pacific coastline and the ports within were not available to BC or potentially to Canada. For the Canadians, Seward's Folly appeared to indicate that his plan for continental domination was coming to fruition.

I just finished a book by deceased US historian Robin W. Winks who was the head of Canadian Studies at Yale. The title of the book is , The Civil War Years: Canada and the United States

I learned quite a bit about William Seward in this book and even more about the tensions between Canada and Britain and the US during the civil war.

Cheers,

George
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/17/2023 7:13:47 AM
Quote:
BTW Morris, & George, Do you guys use the website, "gas buddy"? It will tell you what stations have the cheapest gas in your area? Every penny counts! ☺


Hi MD, I live in a rural area and I get to know where the cheapest gas is. But the difference is usually only pennies per litre so I wouldn't drive a long distance to get gas.

There is a city called Peterborough about one hour from me. Now it has cheaper gas, sometimes 10 cents per litre difference from most parts of Ontario. I always gas up there if I'm passing through. Apparently the stations there sell some of the cheapest fuel in Ontario.

But the cheapest fuel is always on the Mohawk FN reserve, Tyendinaga. The businesses there are exempt from some of the taxes placed on fuel but I'm not going to drive 40 minutes to buy that fuel. I would waste more in fuel just getting there and back.

So when I need gas, I just pony up.

Cheers,

George
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/17/2023 8:27:18 AM
The Continental Congress passed a law forbidding trade with Canadian colonies on May 17, 1775. What was the purpose of that ban?

The British Parliament had passed the New England Restraining Act which was endorsed on March 30, 1775 by King George III. This law reinforced British mercantile trade laws compelling the colonies to trade only with Britain or the West Indies. The law was supposed to come into effect on July 1 and later the colonies were banned from fishing in the waters off Newfoundland.

Now the Continental Congress had no legal authority to ban trade with Canada but it had the support of most of the rebellious colonies. So was the ban on trade with the Canadian colonies just a tit for tat measure? Were the 13 colonies upset that they had been rebuffed by Québec and Nova Scotia in the attempt to recruit them to the cause?

I really don't know too much about this economic sanction so if someone can weigh in, I'm all ears.

George
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/18/2023 8:26:41 AM
Last year at this time someone was, stealing Maple Leafs hockey player, Mitch Mariners car!? Is the car theft ring in the old city of York still going strong?? Are the Leafs looking at major changes to their team?? Anyone?

Checking 5-18 in history here is a few events!.comments? Anyone??

1980 the eruption of Mt. St Helens! I wonder if it effected the Vancouver, Victoria area?? Anyone??

1860 Abe Lincoln becomes the Republican Candidate for President! Some say the Republicans back then are like the Democrats of today?? Did the party flip???

1974 India has the Atomic Bomb! Does Pakistan also have it?? Who will keep the peace?? Comments?

1896 the Supreme Court releases a Separate but equal take on Civil Rights!? Can the SC dictate laws even if they represent a minority of the populace!? & Should they have lifetime terms??

Comments anyone??
MD

BTW as far as gas buddy goes, sometimes you drive miles out of your way only to see the price went up !? ☺
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"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/18/2023 12:36:48 PM
Quote:
1896 the Supreme Court releases a Separate but equal take on Civil Rights!? Can the SC dictate laws even if they represent a minority of the populace!? & Should they have lifetime terms??


MD you have highlighted a number of problems with Supreme Courts.

The first is associated with countries that have codified constitutions and Supreme Courts. The legislators view themselves as the lawmakers and many believe that because they are elected representatives of the people, they and only they shall determine whether laws enacted are legal. The Supreme Court must interpret those laws with respect to the constitution and to determine whether a law enacted in a legislature is valid, or legal. It places the legislature at odds with the Supreme Court.

The second issue concerns whether the Supreme Court members represent all of the people. In theory they should, don't you think? I found any association of an SC member with one political party to be offensive. As much as possible these people should be neutral and while they may have political opinions, their judgments should reflect the values of the greater portion of the population. What a country cannot afford to have is a SC justice appointed for life who has extreme views and allows them to cloud his judgement or makes his decisions because he is indebted to the person that nominated him.

And so the third issue then and it is related to the second is the selection process. I must confess that I find the circus atmosphere that surrounds SC selections to be troubling. While I can accept that the President makes a nomination for SC and that the Senate approves, it seems to me that the President should not have so much say in the nomination selection.

I feel that an arm's length nomination committee should be appointed to come up with a nominations list from which the President may choose. And that means that the appointments to the selection committee become all important. I would go so far as to eliminate the politicians from the nomination process. And the whole process must be transparent.

It is of great concern that a legislative body may reject a Supreme Court nominee based upon that person's political persuasion. I find it distasteful that a nominee who will be charged with an impartial interpretation of the laws of the nation must somehow comport with the political ideology of the majority party in the legislature.

Canada's process to fill positions on the Supreme Court has undergone many modifications over the decades. I would say that our process is now far more transparent than it has been in the past though not as transparent as the process in the US. Partly in the British tradition, there is no legal framework that determines how a judge is chosen. It isn't codified in law.

So any government can make changes to the process and they have. Currently we rely upon an appointed Advisory Board to review candidates and to suggest a nominations list from which the Governor General operating with the direction of the PM, may appoint a SC judge. The Advisory Board is comprised of a retired judge, two lawyers, a legal scholar, and three non-legal members. The currently serving politicians are not in the loop at this stage nor are the political parties.

The board does its research and finds qualified candidates and places 4 or 5 on a list after vetting them thoroughly. At this stage, the public doesn't know who is on the list. There is no circus surrounding the process.

Before the list gets to the PM, the Ministry of Justice now looks at the list and further consultations ensue. The MOJ consults on this list with the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, relevant provincial and territorial attorney generals as well as members of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights, and the Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs. Then the list goes to the PM.

My criticism of our process is that it is not codified. While the Governor General actually appoints the judge, in practice the G-G just follows instructions from the PM. If we are happy with the process used, then we need to make it a law and not a convention subject to modifications at the whim of government.

The US has a very open process and it is codified but I think that the legislature and the President are far too influential in the process.

Now we are far less ideologically driven than the US. Perhaps that is why people don't tend to pay a great deal of attention to the SC selections. The assumption is that these are good, responsible people who are well versed in the law and have practised law and have been judges for at least 10 years. And I cannot recall ever hearing a discussion of the ideological split on our 9 person Supreme Court.

The last issue is the age factor. I have problems with a life time appointment. It seems to me that 75 or 80 years of age is a good time to pass the reigns with options to remove a sitting judge whose competency is at question. An age maximum ensures that new blood will join the SC more rapidly.

Cheers,

George
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/18/2023 5:09:59 PM
George,

As far as the Supreme Court goes, I agree for the most part of your take on this. You can pretty much count on the fact that SC Justices are indeed partisan to wards the President, & party who nominated & voted them in!? & being in the SC for a lifetime, is ridiculous! There has to be a better, & more fair way!???

Contempt of the court!!?
MD
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
Brian Grafton
Victoria BC Canada
Posts: 4811
Joined: 2004
This day in World History! Continued
5/18/2023 7:17:40 PM
MD, to your Quote:
BTW Morris, & George, Do you guys use the website, "gas buddy"? It will tell you what stations have the cheapest gas in your area? Every penny counts!

I have friends who have ‘gas buddies’ either on their computers or possibly their phones. But it has limited value in at least my part of Canada. By-and-large, by whatever means, our gas prices are set by undefined regions. The cost 40 km north of Victoria will be lower than here by as much as $0.06/liter (about $0.25/US gallon. But within our region (Greater Victoria? Who knows: it’s undefined) there will not be any variance in price. There are, I believe, 2 Co-op stations which may refund a percentage of profit to signed-up users; the rest of the stations will show identical prices. We are told this does not indicate collusion or price control. It is simply supply and demand that would lead every station in an area serving 300,000 people will alter prices to exactly the same degree within an hour or two. Sure … how much you want tor that bridge ?

The only time there is any use for ‘gas buddy’ is when there is rampant flexibility in prices, which has been happening at times over the past 16 months. I have seen overnight shifts of as much as $0.15/liter ($0.60/US gal). So if you happen to need gas at the moment of change, “gas buddy” can save you some money.

Gas prices in my province are high, in part because of various provincial levees. In major cities – largely Greater Vancouver and Greater Victoria – there are additional levees to support local transportation initiatives. Last time I needed gas, the pump price was $189.9/liter – about $7.70/US gallon. Not cheap, but pretty much unwavering throughout my region. I’m driving much less recently!

Cheers
Brian G

----------------------------------
"We have met the enemy, and he is us." Walt Kelly. "The Best Things in Life Aren't Things" Bumper sticker.
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 7:11:39 AM

Again most of these topics haven't been commented on!? What say you??

From 5-18 in world history here is a few events!.comments? Anyone??

1980 the eruption of Mt. St Helens! I wonder if it effected the Vancouver, Victoria, & other areas of the US, & Canada? How far did the ashes go??

1860 Abe Lincoln becomes the Republican Candidate for President! Some say the Republicans back then are like the Democrats of today?? Did the party flip???

1974 India has the Atomic Bomb! Does Pakistan also have it?? Who will keep the peace?? Comments?

1896 the Supreme Court releases a Separate but equal take on Civil Rights!? Can the SC dictate laws even if they represent a minority of the populace!? & Should they have lifetime terms? Thanks for your comments!

Any comments from 5-19, we missed a few I'm sure??

Here are some topics from 5-20, feel free to comment on any of them!??

1536 Ann Boleyn, wife of Henry VIII, is beheaded for Adultry! Why wasn't King Henry? He committed Adultery even more!? Is this a double standard? Anyone?

1845 Sir John Franklin's expedition to find the NW Passage leaves England, never to be seen again! That is until recent searches by Canadians turned up their 2 ships!? What's the latest from Parks Canada on this?? Anyone?

1884 the Ringling Brothers Circus is started, why in modern times to people think animals are abused! & therefore boycott the Circus?? Is it warranted??

Carry on all!
MD

1962 TE Lawrence, of Arabia fame is killed in a moter cycle accident! How important was he to British- Arab Middle-eastern history?? What say you??

Comments anyone??
MD

BTW Brian, I see your point on living in Victoria BC, on a island, Gas buddy would only be of limited help!?
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
morris crumley
Dunwoody GA USA
Posts: 3309
Joined: 2007
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 8:30:50 AM

" Abe Lincoln......some say the Republicans back then are like the Democrats of today??? Did the party flip???

Who says that.....MD....democrats.... wishing to deny the history of what their party once supported by claiming they have flipped. By calling black Republicans "Uncle Toms" I don`t think so.

Sorry, but you chose to bring it up!

Respects, Morris
----------------------------------
"You are a $70, red-wool, pure quill military genius, or the biggest damn fool in northern Mexico."
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 8:43:52 AM
Hi Morris

Google it, there are so many websites, & non partisan groups out there, that profess this? My American History Professors, all, also concurred!? Tell me why was the South solid Democrat before the Civil War, then after Lincoln they switched to totally Republican!?? The parties did flip!!

Peace,
MD
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
morris crumley
Dunwoody GA USA
Posts: 3309
Joined: 2007
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 9:53:23 AM
Dave, I would be happy to PM you about why I made my comment. If you are interested let me know if you would hear me out, respectfully.

As to GOOGLE and professors and "non partisan groups"...I think you can guess my position.

One detail I will say on the open forum in response to what you stated about "after the civil war the south turned Republican"....I grew up in the sixties ( when I was old enough to comprehend such things) and my state, Georgia had 1...that`s one Republican congressman. That is one hundred years after the civil war. In the 1980`s one party elected as it`s leader in the US Senate a Grand Cleagle of the Klan...who actually uttered the N.. word on the Senate floor...Robert Byrd. A greater percentage of Republicans in the congress voted for the civil rights legislation in the 60`s than did democrats.

Those statues to confederate leaders that were torn down or removed a couple of years ago in Maryland and Baltimore....were dedicated as memorials by the father of Nancy Pelosi who was Mayor.

Clinton eulogized the man who he called "his mentor" an Arkansas power ....and segregationist... named J. William Fulbright. One of only two black Senators currently seated, Tim Scott, has openly been called an "Uncle Tom" which is a racist term, by members of congress in the other party.

The first black nominated to the Supreme Court since the passing of Justice Thurgood Marshall was Clarence Thomas who was slandered in an attempt to sabotage his nomination by people of the other party who have also used the same racist term on him...and worse.

I could go on, but I won`t unless in a PM...but to say that the parties "flipped" after the civil war is, in my honest opinion....just not the case.

Respectfully, Morris
----------------------------------
"You are a $70, red-wool, pure quill military genius, or the biggest damn fool in northern Mexico."
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 1:31:44 PM
On May 19, 1780 it was reported that total darkness descended upon New England and parts of what would become eastern Canada, at about noon. What was not known then but appears to be known now or accepted now is that forest fires in Canada plus westerly winds sent clouds of smoke over New England. In combination with fog and cloud cover, it was sufficient to create darkness at midday.

Reports from the day indicate that people had to light candles in order to see in their homes.

There was fear and panic. Some people took this as an omen. Others prayed for forgiveness.

It was 1780 and I certainly hope that some of them prayed for redemption for having the temerity to rebel against the mother country.

There is scientific evidence to prove that the darkest day in New England coincided with massive forest fires in the Algonquin Highlands to the north of my part of the world, in Ontario. Naturalists have tested the trees of burned forests in Ontario and have found burn marks on the growth rings that date back to that time period.


A short piece on this event from the New England Historical Society.

[Read More]

As I write, forest fires in Alberta are consuming many acres of boreal forest trees. And the smoke from those fires has blown well to the east and that accounts for hazy skies in eastern parts of Canada and Québec and some of the US border states.



Mother Nature at work today and in 1780.

Cheers,

George

Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 1:36:21 PM
Quote:

" Abe Lincoln......some say the Republicans back then are like the Democrats of today??? Did the party flip???

Who says that.....MD....democrats.... wishing to deny the history of what their party once supported by claiming they have flipped. By calling black Republicans "Uncle Toms" I don`t think so.

Sorry, but you chose to bring it up!
Respects, Morris



Hi Morris,

I choose to just let it go, neither one of us would change our positions!

Not a big deal,
Regards,
MD
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 7:53:15 PM
Quote:
On May 19, 1780 it was reported that total darkness descended upon New England and parts of what would become eastern Canada, at about noon. What was not known then but appears to be known now or accepted now is that forest fires in Canada plus westerly winds sent clouds of smoke over New England. In combination with fog and cloud cover, it was sufficient to create darkness at midday.

Reports from the day indicate that people had to light candles in order to see in their homes.

There was fear and panic. Some people took this as an omen. Others prayed for forgiveness.

It was 1780 and I certainly hope that some of them prayed for redemption for having the temerity to rebel against the mother country.
There is scientific evidence to prove that the darkest day in New England coincided with massive forest fires in the Algonquin Highlands to the north of my part of the world, in Ontario. Naturalists have tested the trees of burned forests in Ontario and have found burn marks on the growth rings that date back to that time period.


A short piece on this event from the New England Historical Society.

[Read More]

As I write, forest fires in Alberta are consuming many acres of boreal forest trees. And the smoke from those fires has blown well to the east and that accounts for hazy skies in eastern parts of Canada and Québec and some of the US border states.



Mother Nature at work today and in 1780.

Cheers,

George




Hi George,

Canada must have had some mammoth forest fires, having so much in standing timber! Any charts or website showing the top most destructive fires??

Thanks,
MD
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
Michigan Dave
Muskegon MI USA
Posts: 8310
Joined: 2006
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 7:57:51 PM
5-19-1845 Sir John Franklin's expedition to find the NW Passage leaves England, never to be seen again! That is until recent searches by Canadians turned up their 2 ships!? What's the latest from Parks Canada on this?? What is the latest new finds on the wrecks? Any videos or articles?? Anyone?

Regards,
MD
----------------------------------
"The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract."
George
Centre Hastings ON Canada
Posts: 13550
Joined: 2009
This day in World History! Continued
5/19/2023 9:41:52 PM
Quote:
5-19-1845 Sir John Franklin's expedition to find the NW Passage leaves England, never to be seen again! That is until recent searches by Canadians turned up their 2 ships!? What's the latest from Parks Canada on this?? What is the latest new finds on the wrecks? Any videos or articles?? Anyone?

Regards,
MD



In Sept. of 2022, Parks Canada enjoyed an 11 day window in which they made 56 dives on HMS Erebus. PC is concentrating on that ship because it is in shallow water and takes quite a pounding from wave action. HMS Terror is in deeper water and the cold seems to have preserved the ship in a much better state than Erebus. So the decision was taken to concentrate on Erebus because it is in danger of breaking up much more quickly.

During the Sept. dive, 275 artifacts were removed from the ship.

Short CBC story on the 2022 dives

[Read More]

Parks Canada also made ice dives on the wrecks in April and May of 2022. The weather is a factor that determines when and how long activities around the wrecks can take place.

George
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